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August 12, 2009
I Hate New York - 29
New York State used to provide one of the sweetest deals around for the two-season, out-of-state turkey hunter. You’d buy a nonresident small-game license ($55) then lock in for four turkey tags: two fall, and two spring ($30). That grand total of $85 always felt like a steal as New York has often proven to be one of the more enjoyable states to turkey hunt, with abundant birds, public land, and plenty of accommodating landowners, especially upstate. Not now. In this age of economic downturn, prices just jumped. Can you say sticker shock? The nonresident turkey tags for the coming 2009-2010 hunting seasons, again still four total, just inflated like a strutting spring gobbler to $50. Even the small-game license for out-of-staters got bigger, elevating to $85 — the former benchmark for both small game license and turkey tags. Resident small game by the way went from $16 to $26, while the turkey permit doubled in price from $5 to $10. The 2009-2010 New York State hunting, fishing, and trapping licenses and Deer Management Permits (DMPs) go on sale beginning Monday, August 17, 2009. As usual, licenses and permits can be purchased at one of DEC's 1,500 license sales outlets statewide, or ordered by mail, telephone and online at www.dec.ny.gov <http://www.dec.ny.gov/> (look for the "Purchase a Sporting License" link on the home page). All sporting licenses are valid beginning Oct. 1, 2009, through Sept. 30, 2010. The new fees will be in effect for purchase of all 2009-2010 licenses, and are posted on DEC's website at http://www.dec.ny.gov/permits/6107.html/ <http://www.dec.ny.gov/permits/6107.html/> Information on the changes to the license fees and license structure is available at http://www.dec.ny.gov/permits/54955.html <http://www.dec.ny.gov/permits/54955.html> / I’m still not sure whether to bite the bullet as a sign of the times, or pass on my longtime New York turkey hunting tradition and add another state to my list of five this year. What do you Strut Zoners think?
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Comments (29)
Of course $135 (the required nonresident N.Y. small game license plus the four turkey tags) = $33.75 a bird.
Maybe it's still a good deal? Whaddya think, SZers?
-S.
Ya know there sure are some worse deals out there. You're not just paying for the bird. Personally the experience is just as important as the bag. I definitely don't condone nearly doubling prices in a bad economy. That just doesn't make sense to me. But all in all I wouldn't feel bad paying $135 for a good NY turkey hunt.
Good points SD_Whitetail_Hntr. Sure enough, there are steeper prices for turkey tags and licenses out there. No doubt about it. I think it's a matter of having a sweet deal for a long time then seeing it change dramatically. Bound to happen, I s'pose. Thanks for checkin' in. By the way, what are you seeing for turkey flocks out your way? Hunted the Badlands a couple years back, and loved it.-S.
The problem lies with where all the money is going. Tag fees are skyrocketing, yet the state still wants to close hatcheries, and the likes. Save your $$ and take it to a state that appreciates your business for the right reasons.
Frank66
Historically, New York State has shown a propensity for these sorts of "huh?" decisions which seem to fly in the face of logic. Bad economy? Let's charge more for licenses. It's mind boggling.
After having to put down my turkey dog last fall and after this seemingly never-ending summer of rain, I've actually toyed with the idea of not hunting N.Y. this fall for turkeys. Fearing a miserable hatch, I figured that I'd fall hunt some more promising country. Been delightfully surprised this week to have scouted several groups of hens with poults, however. Now that some of the big fields have been mowed, the family groups are bugging hard. Then yesterday, I watched a hen with 8 first-hatch-sized poults bugging in my wood pile. Guess I'll have to suck it up and pay the increase.
It's time to scout. Can hunting season be far behind? Can't wait.
In Missouri they were going to raise all the permit prices for this year and decided not to with the way the economy was going. They did raise some out of state permits though, so a trip to the midwest might not be on your list. With turkeys you don't really get the management discount, i.e., doe or cow only tags seem to be cheaper and easier to get in a lot of places where they are trying to control the herds. I had a ton of fun hunting antlerless antelope in SD last year and it was only 80 for 3 tags! There's a perception that guys who travel out of state have the extra money, some just like to hunt.
Thanks for the post, Frank66. Good points all. We've got to fork over the dollars to play the game I guess. Or not. I can understand a N.Y. resident getting a break since they pay out in other ways, but the visitor to that state does too. Food and supplies. Lodging. Etc.
I suppose this is just Economics 101 though.
But like Gerry, once I get word about N.Y. turkey flocks from my contacts down there (I write this 3 1/2 hrs. from the border, and hunt spots well beyond that), I'll probably bite the ol' bullet. Part of me is just a little miffed (and maybe disappointed) that the old fees aren't still in place. Sign of the times. It was so good for so long . . .
As Levi mentions, the Midwest is definitely not friendly(costwise) to the traveling turkey hunter. Check out what it takes for a nonres to hunt Iowa sometime. Did it once. Loved it. Likely won't in the near future.
In the end though, as they say, you can't take it with you, so . . .
-S.
If you want out of state sticker shock just come out west to hunt anything. I have to get drawn in Arizona for either spring or fall and I'm allowed only one bird a year. That's as a resident. I don't mind the fees I pay in Arizona because that is just about the only way the Game and Fish department gets any money. But I've checked into hunting in Colorado and New Mexico for turkey (elk and deer have just about gotten out of reach for me in those states) and in NM the cost has just about doubled from when I first went several years ago to around $110 and that is for one bird. BUT, if I don't get drawn in AZ and the jones has me bad I will suck it up and buy that out of state tag.
I live in upstate NY, but grew up in western Ma. For the past 5 years my father has been getting a nonres small game license and joining me for opening day of grouse season in a spot where we get 20 flushes in a morning... the rate increase is forcing him to bow out, because its not worth it. Its too bad, because he is not alone. policy like this leads only to higher license costs.
Unfortunately the cost of enjoying the sport we love is going up in FL. also.Not only hunting and fishing license but auto and trailer tags have doubled this past year.Between my hunting and fishing license which cover general gun,spring gobbler and fresh and salt water fishing license and tagging all are farm trucks and trailors,it's setting me back over $500.00 dollars,something has got to give somewhere cause us poor boys are about tapped out.
I can think of a lot more reasons to hate New York.
The lifetime fees remain in effect until September 30 for NY residents and NY residents should look at these. NY residents 65 plus years of age can get there residenct sporting license for $50.00 until 30 Sep 2009 which includes turkey tages and they will continue to qualify for free doe tag applications.
What really bugged me is senior licences went from 65 to 70 this year.
I have lived in Western and the Adirondack sections of NY my entire life. The price raises this year are not only in response to the state of the economy, this an indirect attempt to making hunting and fishing to expense for the common person and therefore they can make it illegal and then there will be no reason for a citizen to have a gun, so they can make that illegal too! Hopefully I'm wrong but I would not put it past Albany and NYC.
As a group we should flex our $$ muscle and refuse to purchase these new licenses for 1 year and see what the response from our state legislatures would be. If hunters and anglers banded together and did not bicker among ourselves would be respected by government.
Steve, I'm from East River SD, which for those of you who aren't familiar, we pretty much consider it two different worlds each direction of the Missouri River. Turkey flocks on this side are very limited. I'm originally from a very northern area in the state and there has been a half successful population of wild turkey along some of the James River Valley but I haven't hunted around that area for a few years and don't know how it has progressed. Black Hills area of West River is still the only legitimate turkey hunting in the state as far as I know. Could be wrong.
Hey SD_Whitetail_Hntr,
We hunted the Badlands. Prairie turkeys. Interior, SD.
-S.
Guys,
Here's the South Dakota turkey hunting link:
http://www.sdgfp.info/Wildlife/hunting/BigGame/Turkey.htm
-S.
I live in upstate NY also and wouldn't think of going a season without hunting.I don't know how many more I have left. We can flex our muscle by voting the bums out. Demand a primary for every position up for vote.I'm not saying switch parties just don't vote for any incumbent. We're up to our hips in turkeys.
I live in upstate NY also and wouldn't think of going a season without hunting.I don't know how many more I have left. We can flex our muscle by voting the bums out. Demand a primary for every position up for vote.I'm not saying switch parties just don't vote for any incumbent. We're up to our hips in turkeys.
Hey trebor,
Thanks for checking in . . .
Yeah, N.Y. turkey hunting residents still have a pretty good deal at $26 for the small game license now, and $10 for the turkey permit.
As a gobbler and flock chasing fool based in Maine, this inflated price increase for nonresidents makes a guy think a little bit about making the long run down. I say this as a guy who has loved hunting N.Y. turkeys over the years . . .
-S.
Yes I would have guessed the badlands have held on to some turkeys as well. Not a bad place for Antelope either. I'm disappointed I haven't attempted for an antelope tag out there yet. And I should have been working on preference points for Custer State Park Elk a long time ago but this kid still has a fairly significant amount of college debt to get down before I get to outta hand.
Good hunting out there in the B'lands, as much for the turkeys as the moonscape scenery.
-S.
is there very much public land in S.D. for antelope hunting
$33.75 per bird NR still sounds like a good deal as long as the funds are going into the game department and not being used for other projects.
per bird NR in:
MN - $85
IA -$100.50
WY -$80
NE - $91
WI- $65.25 additional tags 15 each may purchase one per day.
As a resident of WI - license $15 includes tag for first turkey. purchase additional tages $10 each limit 1 per day until sold out. Fall tags have never sold out.
WI may be the best fall turkey deal in the nation.
I plan to have 11 in state fall turkey tags this fall costing a total of $115. With a deal like this I do not need to travel out state for fall turkey hunting. Truly a hunter's paradise.
OK Steve,
So where is your line? How much is too much $$$, before you say no. Not all folks have an expense account, or 6 digit salary, like others.
The problem doesn't necessarily lie with the rising fees,per say, as much as it lies with how much of those fees go back to the outdoors. Or more to the point, much much of the fees are NOT going back into the outdoors.
For the people that live in NY and pay tax on everything, except their next breathe, a hike in license fees this drastic, is simply unexceptable.
It's an anti-gun state, full of gungrabbers, and a hike in fees like we got just leaves another bad taste in our mouths.
I wouldn't care so much if it were a pro-gun state, with liberal carry laws, but it's not.
Frank66
tentsteak - I'm not from around antelope country here in SD so I can't speak with any exact terms. Here is the game fish web page where you can find public land maps. http://www.sdgfp.info/Wildlife/PublicLands/PubLand.htm
Hey Steve! Been awhile since I've checked in. Good to see some good discussions going on!
As for the price increase, it is definitely a dramatic change and worth complaining about. Doesn't make much sense in this economy. But, I wouldn't let that deter me from some great hunts and memories. This is what we love, and to me it is hard to put a price tag on something we love cso much. I know you're just as passionate, and "my money" says "your money" will will be forked over to New York for some future hunts and memories! At least I hope so, so I can read about them in future posts and articles!
As for a turkey report, I've got three flocks visiting daily on my property. Bad thing is they have found my bird feeders, something I had hoped wouldn't happen. It is kind of enjoyable though! Also saw three toms in a swamp not far from my place when I was setting up one of my game cameras. Ended up with pics of deer, turkey and bear.
Can't wait for Fall to get here!
Good luck all!
James
Hey James,
Thanks for checking in buddy, and for the turkey report. Good stuff.
Yeah, I'll no doubt cave in after all my whining. Usually do!
Keep us in the loop . . .
-S.
NEWSFLASH:
The divorce was annulled and the reconciliation certain as I ponied up $135 this morning for a New York NR small-game and turkey permit. Thanks for all the comments guys . . .
As Strut Zoner James said, "I know you're just as passionate, and 'my money' says 'your money' will be forked over to New York for some future hunts and memories!"
A betting man like J. would also play the lottery today!
-S.
And for those of us that live, work, and hunt within the same 40 miles in NY, so sad, too bad......
Post a Comment (200 characters or less)
Unfortunately the cost of enjoying the sport we love is going up in FL. also.Not only hunting and fishing license but auto and trailer tags have doubled this past year.Between my hunting and fishing license which cover general gun,spring gobbler and fresh and salt water fishing license and tagging all are farm trucks and trailors,it's setting me back over $500.00 dollars,something has got to give somewhere cause us poor boys are about tapped out.
If you want out of state sticker shock just come out west to hunt anything. I have to get drawn in Arizona for either spring or fall and I'm allowed only one bird a year. That's as a resident. I don't mind the fees I pay in Arizona because that is just about the only way the Game and Fish department gets any money. But I've checked into hunting in Colorado and New Mexico for turkey (elk and deer have just about gotten out of reach for me in those states) and in NM the cost has just about doubled from when I first went several years ago to around $110 and that is for one bird. BUT, if I don't get drawn in AZ and the jones has me bad I will suck it up and buy that out of state tag.
I live in upstate NY, but grew up in western Ma. For the past 5 years my father has been getting a nonres small game license and joining me for opening day of grouse season in a spot where we get 20 flushes in a morning... the rate increase is forcing him to bow out, because its not worth it. Its too bad, because he is not alone. policy like this leads only to higher license costs.
The problem lies with where all the money is going. Tag fees are skyrocketing, yet the state still wants to close hatcheries, and the likes. Save your $$ and take it to a state that appreciates your business for the right reasons.
Frank66
In Missouri they were going to raise all the permit prices for this year and decided not to with the way the economy was going. They did raise some out of state permits though, so a trip to the midwest might not be on your list. With turkeys you don't really get the management discount, i.e., doe or cow only tags seem to be cheaper and easier to get in a lot of places where they are trying to control the herds. I had a ton of fun hunting antlerless antelope in SD last year and it was only 80 for 3 tags! There's a perception that guys who travel out of state have the extra money, some just like to hunt.
Of course $135 (the required nonresident N.Y. small game license plus the four turkey tags) = $33.75 a bird.
Maybe it's still a good deal? Whaddya think, SZers?
-S.
Good points SD_Whitetail_Hntr. Sure enough, there are steeper prices for turkey tags and licenses out there. No doubt about it. I think it's a matter of having a sweet deal for a long time then seeing it change dramatically. Bound to happen, I s'pose. Thanks for checkin' in. By the way, what are you seeing for turkey flocks out your way? Hunted the Badlands a couple years back, and loved it.-S.
Historically, New York State has shown a propensity for these sorts of "huh?" decisions which seem to fly in the face of logic. Bad economy? Let's charge more for licenses. It's mind boggling.
After having to put down my turkey dog last fall and after this seemingly never-ending summer of rain, I've actually toyed with the idea of not hunting N.Y. this fall for turkeys. Fearing a miserable hatch, I figured that I'd fall hunt some more promising country. Been delightfully surprised this week to have scouted several groups of hens with poults, however. Now that some of the big fields have been mowed, the family groups are bugging hard. Then yesterday, I watched a hen with 8 first-hatch-sized poults bugging in my wood pile. Guess I'll have to suck it up and pay the increase.
It's time to scout. Can hunting season be far behind? Can't wait.
Thanks for the post, Frank66. Good points all. We've got to fork over the dollars to play the game I guess. Or not. I can understand a N.Y. resident getting a break since they pay out in other ways, but the visitor to that state does too. Food and supplies. Lodging. Etc.
I suppose this is just Economics 101 though.
But like Gerry, once I get word about N.Y. turkey flocks from my contacts down there (I write this 3 1/2 hrs. from the border, and hunt spots well beyond that), I'll probably bite the ol' bullet. Part of me is just a little miffed (and maybe disappointed) that the old fees aren't still in place. Sign of the times. It was so good for so long . . .
As Levi mentions, the Midwest is definitely not friendly(costwise) to the traveling turkey hunter. Check out what it takes for a nonres to hunt Iowa sometime. Did it once. Loved it. Likely won't in the near future.
In the end though, as they say, you can't take it with you, so . . .
-S.
The lifetime fees remain in effect until September 30 for NY residents and NY residents should look at these. NY residents 65 plus years of age can get there residenct sporting license for $50.00 until 30 Sep 2009 which includes turkey tages and they will continue to qualify for free doe tag applications.
What really bugged me is senior licences went from 65 to 70 this year.
Hey SD_Whitetail_Hntr,
We hunted the Badlands. Prairie turkeys. Interior, SD.
-S.
I live in upstate NY also and wouldn't think of going a season without hunting.I don't know how many more I have left. We can flex our muscle by voting the bums out. Demand a primary for every position up for vote.I'm not saying switch parties just don't vote for any incumbent. We're up to our hips in turkeys.
Hey Steve! Been awhile since I've checked in. Good to see some good discussions going on!
As for the price increase, it is definitely a dramatic change and worth complaining about. Doesn't make much sense in this economy. But, I wouldn't let that deter me from some great hunts and memories. This is what we love, and to me it is hard to put a price tag on something we love cso much. I know you're just as passionate, and "my money" says "your money" will will be forked over to New York for some future hunts and memories! At least I hope so, so I can read about them in future posts and articles!
As for a turkey report, I've got three flocks visiting daily on my property. Bad thing is they have found my bird feeders, something I had hoped wouldn't happen. It is kind of enjoyable though! Also saw three toms in a swamp not far from my place when I was setting up one of my game cameras. Ended up with pics of deer, turkey and bear.
Can't wait for Fall to get here!
Good luck all!
James
Ya know there sure are some worse deals out there. You're not just paying for the bird. Personally the experience is just as important as the bag. I definitely don't condone nearly doubling prices in a bad economy. That just doesn't make sense to me. But all in all I wouldn't feel bad paying $135 for a good NY turkey hunt.
I have lived in Western and the Adirondack sections of NY my entire life. The price raises this year are not only in response to the state of the economy, this an indirect attempt to making hunting and fishing to expense for the common person and therefore they can make it illegal and then there will be no reason for a citizen to have a gun, so they can make that illegal too! Hopefully I'm wrong but I would not put it past Albany and NYC.
As a group we should flex our $$ muscle and refuse to purchase these new licenses for 1 year and see what the response from our state legislatures would be. If hunters and anglers banded together and did not bicker among ourselves would be respected by government.
Steve, I'm from East River SD, which for those of you who aren't familiar, we pretty much consider it two different worlds each direction of the Missouri River. Turkey flocks on this side are very limited. I'm originally from a very northern area in the state and there has been a half successful population of wild turkey along some of the James River Valley but I haven't hunted around that area for a few years and don't know how it has progressed. Black Hills area of West River is still the only legitimate turkey hunting in the state as far as I know. Could be wrong.
Guys,
Here's the South Dakota turkey hunting link:
http://www.sdgfp.info/Wildlife/hunting/BigGame/Turkey.htm
-S.
I live in upstate NY also and wouldn't think of going a season without hunting.I don't know how many more I have left. We can flex our muscle by voting the bums out. Demand a primary for every position up for vote.I'm not saying switch parties just don't vote for any incumbent. We're up to our hips in turkeys.
Hey trebor,
Thanks for checking in . . .
Yeah, N.Y. turkey hunting residents still have a pretty good deal at $26 for the small game license now, and $10 for the turkey permit.
As a gobbler and flock chasing fool based in Maine, this inflated price increase for nonresidents makes a guy think a little bit about making the long run down. I say this as a guy who has loved hunting N.Y. turkeys over the years . . .
-S.
Yes I would have guessed the badlands have held on to some turkeys as well. Not a bad place for Antelope either. I'm disappointed I haven't attempted for an antelope tag out there yet. And I should have been working on preference points for Custer State Park Elk a long time ago but this kid still has a fairly significant amount of college debt to get down before I get to outta hand.
Good hunting out there in the B'lands, as much for the turkeys as the moonscape scenery.
-S.
$33.75 per bird NR still sounds like a good deal as long as the funds are going into the game department and not being used for other projects.
per bird NR in:
MN - $85
IA -$100.50
WY -$80
NE - $91
WI- $65.25 additional tags 15 each may purchase one per day.
As a resident of WI - license $15 includes tag for first turkey. purchase additional tages $10 each limit 1 per day until sold out. Fall tags have never sold out.
WI may be the best fall turkey deal in the nation.
I plan to have 11 in state fall turkey tags this fall costing a total of $115. With a deal like this I do not need to travel out state for fall turkey hunting. Truly a hunter's paradise.
OK Steve,
So where is your line? How much is too much $$$, before you say no. Not all folks have an expense account, or 6 digit salary, like others.
The problem doesn't necessarily lie with the rising fees,per say, as much as it lies with how much of those fees go back to the outdoors. Or more to the point, much much of the fees are NOT going back into the outdoors.
For the people that live in NY and pay tax on everything, except their next breathe, a hike in license fees this drastic, is simply unexceptable.
It's an anti-gun state, full of gungrabbers, and a hike in fees like we got just leaves another bad taste in our mouths.
I wouldn't care so much if it were a pro-gun state, with liberal carry laws, but it's not.
Frank66
tentsteak - I'm not from around antelope country here in SD so I can't speak with any exact terms. Here is the game fish web page where you can find public land maps. http://www.sdgfp.info/Wildlife/PublicLands/PubLand.htm
NEWSFLASH:
The divorce was annulled and the reconciliation certain as I ponied up $135 this morning for a New York NR small-game and turkey permit. Thanks for all the comments guys . . .
As Strut Zoner James said, "I know you're just as passionate, and 'my money' says 'your money' will be forked over to New York for some future hunts and memories!"
A betting man like J. would also play the lottery today!
-S.
I can think of a lot more reasons to hate New York.
is there very much public land in S.D. for antelope hunting
Hey James,
Thanks for checking in buddy, and for the turkey report. Good stuff.
Yeah, I'll no doubt cave in after all my whining. Usually do!
Keep us in the loop . . .
-S.
And for those of us that live, work, and hunt within the same 40 miles in NY, so sad, too bad......
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