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The End of Proper Wolf Management

The End of Proper Wolf Management

In the West, legal maneuvers, politics and bureaucracy have made proper wolf management almost impossible. Take an in-depth look at the main players behind the Wolf War.
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from fisherus wrote 3 years 9 weeks ago

Coastal-Coyote,
Don't know our biology,huh? When did you learn yours. I didn't take a retarded chimpanzee very long to figure out that wolves kill and kill and kill. If you're so smart, then why did our forefathers out west finally have to eliminate wolves to sustain their cattle business's. Why didn't the wiley old wolf just stick to eating wildgame? Well, Mr. Smarts, the wolf had depleted the wildlife to almost extinction before Teddy Roosevelt saw what was happening and the Feds started eliminating them. If that hadn't happened, we wouldn't have any elk left. If we don't get control and limit their numbers it will happen now. Actually, it already has. You just really don't know much do you?

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from Coastal-Coyote wrote 3 years 35 weeks ago

"B'AWW, WOLFS ARE EATING /MY/ ELK!"
Get. Over. It.
I fully support the reintroduction of Red Wolves to Florida, and, if they ever are, I won't be getting my panties in a bunch over it. Who CARES if a predator has to kill something to survive? The only reason why I hunt whitetails is because I need the meat. Beef is ridiculously expensive for such low-quality meat.
Yes, we DO need a season on Wolves. However, listing them as predators is a big no-no. The population is still recovering; there are areas that need wolf hunts, and areas that do NOT.
There WILL be drops in populations of game like Elk, and it WILL be drastic. This is completely natural and WILL straighten its self out- even if it takes several wobbly years. It just sounds like too many Elk Hunters, etc. are being offended by the fact that there won't be as many Elk for 'them' in the following seasons. YOU can stroll to Wal-Mart and buy a pack of frozen Ground Beef, but a Wolf, Coyote, Cougar, etc. can't.
Furthermore, ranchers are often PAID to not kill wolves in reaction to predation of their livestock.
On the topic of Wolves attacking domestic animals, so be it. Don't leave pet food out. ALWAYS leave lights on outside your house if you need to let the dog out at night, or, better yet, put their leash on. It's not hard.
HUNTERS SHOULD BE SUPPORTERS OF CONSERVATION.
I see this anti-predator bullshit EVERYWHERE. Did you guys not take High School Biology? Dear LORD. Have some respect for your environment.

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from Coastal-Coyote wrote 3 years 35 weeks ago

"B'AWW, WOLFS ARE EATING /MY/ ELK!"
Get. Over. It.
I fully support the reintroduction of Red Wolves to Florida, and, if they ever are, I won't be getting my panties in a bunch over it. Who CARES if a predator has to kill something to survive? The only reason why I hunt whitetails is because I need the meat. Beef is ridiculously expensive for such low-quality meat.
Yes, we DO need a season on Wolves. However, listing them as predators is a big no-no. The population is still recovering; there are areas that need wolf hunts, and areas that do NOT.
There WILL be drops in populations of game like Elk, and it WILL be drastic. This is completely natural and WILL straighten its self out- even if it takes several wobbly years. It just sounds like too many Elk Hunters, etc. are being offended by the fact that there won't be as many Elk for 'them' in the following seasons. YOU can stroll to Wal-Mart and buy a pack of frozen Ground Beef, but a Wolf, Coyote, Cougar, etc. can't.
Furthermore, ranchers are often PAID to not kill wolves in reaction to predation of their livestock.
On the topic of Wolves attacking domestic animals, so be it. Don't leave pet food out. ALWAYS leave lights on outside your house if you need to let the dog out at night, or, better yet, put their leash on. It's not hard.
HUNTERS SHOULD BE SUPPORTERS OF CONSERVATION.
I see this anti-predator bullshit EVERYWHERE. Did you guys not take High School Biology? Dear LORD. Have some respect for your environment.

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from Montanagyrene wrote 3 years 40 weeks ago

I feel that I HAVE to reply to Gregory L.A. Chilcote’ s comment about ”just as they irrationally over-react to the brucellosis threat posed by free roaming bison”. Brucellosis is ACTUALLY a VERY serious deal!! I’d hate to think of all the taxes I’ve paid over the years that were directed towards making states able to be certified ‘brucellosis free’, only to LOSE that certification because of some misguided comments!! Do I advocate extermination of the bison herds? Not in the slightest!! What I DO believe in, and this goes for ANY animal, is sound, SCIENTIFIC controls, and that the POLITICIANS and so-called ENVIRONMENTALISTS keep OUT OF THE WAY!! Sorry for the tirade, but the ONLY people I’ve ever seen putting their money where their mouth is seem to be those purchase hunting and fishing licenses, boat fuel, equipment, etc.

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from elcazador wrote 3 years 41 weeks ago

How much sense does it make for a hunter not to be a tree hugger??? why would a hunter be against any paticular animal?? the wolf is decimating local deer and elk populations good lord are they better at decimating populations of species then humans??? i love the hunt i love nature but maybe some hunters should remember to respect and coexisit with nature instead of aiming there guns and shooting away. problems are not solved that way and hunting is not just about that. hunt the wolf but dont hate the wolf. maybe if hunters showed more respect and love for the great outdoors instead of just focusing on shooting everything in the great outdoors all of our fortunes would improve.

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from gloomhound wrote 3 years 41 weeks ago

That's not a wolf..it's a coyote. What kind of season do they have on coyotes out there?

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from Gregory L.A. Ch... wrote 3 years 43 weeks ago

Wolf management is a particularly difficult issue because any discussion of it engenders powerful emotional responses on the parts of most of the participants. What outdoorsman doesn't thrill to the hauntingly eery howl of pure wilderness that is the song of the wolf? The reality is that wolves are very efficient predators who are going to remain an ever increasing presence in the West. Their efficiency is so complete, however, that they have been known to completely eliminate large prey from vast territories; leaving large regions devoid of ungulates for many decades. As proof, both the Alaska Peninsula and the Alaska's Seward peninsula had no moose populations prior to the late 1930's and the advent of wolf control measures instituted by the territory of Alaska. Now, both wolves and moose inhabit the area in significant numbers.
Regarding midwest wolves, I suspect they will become a problem in Minnesota and Michigan when they start preying on farm crops, new automobiles and mining products. In the west, however, they are viewed, and rightly so, as potential predators upon the area's chief industrial products; cattle and sheep. Personally I know some ranchers exaggerate this threat (just as they irrationally over-react to the brucellosis threat posed by free roaming bison), nevertheless the impact on wildlife resources cannot be overstated.
Wolves are a wildlife resource like any other; no more, or less deserving of intelligent management. Let's cut the hyperbole and work together to implement thoughtful controls and ensure the continued health of all our wildlife.
I want the thrill from hearing the howl of wolf in the midst of its' wilderness home...but not if it is the only large mammal left.

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from phowriter@msn.com wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

As usual when the federal government gets involved good things are done away with. The history of the federal government and the so called environmentalists have mostly made things worse and with this so called judge making a ruling that will help increase the populaton of the wolf packs, I can't help but say that "the only good wolf is a dead wolf" and there will probably be more wolves killed illegally than there would have been killed legally. This is just another ruling that will make many law-abiding people take the law into their own hands. But I guess the judge and the environmentalists can't help help themselves, "ignorant is as ignorant does".

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from rocco89815 wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

This whole thing is a terrible joke. Idaho game populations are being jeopardized due to the ignorance and emotional whims of politicians and bunny-huggers. Why should Idaho and Montana hunters suffer due to the blind stubbornness of a Wyoming democrat? Let Wyoming suffer it's own decisions. Idaho and Montana have proven they can successfully manage their own herds, and they know what's best for their own populations. I've never been a poacher, nor advocated it, (and I hate to say this) but if I come across a wolf in my hunting area this fall, chances are I'll take a shot at it. I'm taking a stand for what I believe.

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from joe gauthreaux wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

I really have sympathy for our Americans who carve a living out of the land. We are pushed aside by those who call themselves ecologist.
In louisiana we were told that the Alligator was on the endangered species list, and no more public hunting was allowed. Now the alligator is off the endangered list , and the only hunters that are allowed are the landowners. Well not many of the public can afford the land that alligators live on
We are left with the few priveledged people that are allowed to get tags, and those of us who watch the depletion of all the wildlife that are now meals for the gators. Thats right no more fur bearing animals left to trap. We are literally up to our butts in alligators and nothing can be done about it , other than illegaly kill one , or wathc others get rich off our natural resourse, that really belongs to the citizens.
Lots of luck . We know how you feel.

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from charlie elk wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Good post dhottell you bring up a good point -
When the government basically violates their regulations and laws they lose their moral authority making themselves immoral. Leaving a citizen the choice between civil disobedience in an attempt change the government's policy or cowering in fear of their government.
later,
charlie

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from wv trapper wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

These tree huggers and animal huggers are ruining everything.They need to go back under the rock they came from and mind their own business.I wonder what they would say if it was their livestock or thier pet that was killed by wolves, would they want to save them then.They should have never restocked those wolves, they have done more damage than good.

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from nateshamp wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Why doesn't Wyoming just change the management plan? Wolves would get delisted, and a season could be in place.

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from kevcoachk wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

I live in NC & our wolf problem hasn't started, yet. I don't like anything about poaching or breaking game laws in in way; soooo it sounds like Wyoming (and others) should get with the program & met the legal requirements needed for lifting the protected status. Breaking the law only makes you a criminal, so as hunters let's do this the right way. We don't need to fuel the anti's campaign any more than we already do!!

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from Montanagyrene wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

To sheriff8287: It is OBVIOUS that you are misinformed, sir…The wolf never ‘went extinct in the area’ at all!! In spite of the PROVEN presence of wolves, both in Montana, where I used to live, and in Idaho, where I now reside, we STILL got ‘reintroduction’ SHOVED down our throats…As for the ‘dog run’ suggestion, our dog is in a SECURELY maintained back yard in a suburban area, so I guess that qualifies…However, since we enjoy camping, and our dog might be along with us, protection extends to him as well…

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from gmbhunter wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Daverj37---glad to see someone else agrees deer in WI have declined----used to see 5-15 deer a day sitting in woods-----over past 10 years daily sighting numbers keep dropping---now lucky to see 2-3 a day---as I said earlier---see wolves every year now.-------------Tom343---love the idea--lets ship breeding pairs to a whole bunch of states---that way all of them can have cute little wolf pictures----but no deer to hunt.

Editor--I agree with Bullelk----won't need a hunting magazine if no one can hunt----maybe shefiff8287 if he is a fisherman---but the rest of us may have to take up golf. NOT looking to be vigilantes---just would like the federal government to let the states manage their own natural resources---including hunting wolves if they deem it necessary.

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from X2DKkiller wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Andrew I agree with you that is what I am worried about is people just shooting them and then we will never have our chance. We will just be back to sqaure one. But they do need to be managed.

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from Bull Elk wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Andrew, I understand what you are saying, but as we continue this discussion more of our big game animals are being killed by wolves. Yes, my comments may be taken as a little over the top, but it seems clear that the wolf situation is out of control and our government cannot or does not know how to fix it. My fear is that by the time we are able to address the wolf problem, elk, big horn sheep, moose and other big game animals will be seen only by those visiting a museum. When big game no longer exists and hunters have no reason to hunt anymore, will Outdoor Life, and you as O.L. Hunting Editor be relevent?

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from HuntingEditor wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

This is a great discussion, but I am a little nervous about all this enthusiastic vigilantism. I have two perspectives, one very practical: if Idaho gets its way then enforcement for wolves (and wolf poaching) will revert to the feds. And no sportsman I know wants to be on the receiving end of federal wildlife charges. The second perspective is a little more complicated. It's that we sportsmen will tarnish our reputations if we start to take matters in our own hands. Remember, many of us said that all we want is to manage wolves like other wildlife - by hunting and trapping them in legal, regulated seasons. I still maintain that's the best approach. If we start to shoot them illegally, then we just confirm to anti-hunting zealots that hunters can't be trusted to do the right thing, with wolves or other game animals.

Andrew McKean
Hunting Editor

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from daverj37 wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

I hunt in IL and WI and over the past 10 years have seen a severe decline in the WI deer population. In IL they are trying to take away our guns, and in WI they are taking away the reason to have guns.
All I can say is make sure you are informed and vote on election day.
And as for sheriff8287 maybe there was a reason they were hunted to extintion?

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from www.dropjhook.com wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

If you really care about not letting animals go extinct you would realise that since wolves came back the number of the already slim number of bighorn sheep has been dropping like crazy & within a short period the bighorn sheep will be on the endangered list! But hey it's probly what you anti's want, less & less reasons for Americans to go hunting!!

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from tpbesone wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

I live and do most of my hunting in Minnesota. My primary deer hunting area is in the northern part of the state and I can say wolves definitely have an impact on deer herds. Not so say we're out of deer, but given how much wolve sign and wolves I see in a given year we should be able to manage them. Unfortunately the MN DNR isn't doing anything to try and get a hunt here. SSS is definitely used especially by older hunters. I don't participate but unfortunately this is the best solution some people see right now. Wolves have a right to the woods as much as we do, but if we are managing every other species why is this the exception?

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from Bull Elk wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

I have never commented on the same topic twice, but this issue has got my blood boiling. What the wolf has done in the last 10 years may take twice that long to repair, but ONLY if we do something about it right now. I say to every hunter that enters the woods this Fall. If you see a wolf, shoot it. If you see two wolves, shoot both. I hunt in Colorado where the elk herds are doing well. How long before wolves enter this state, then New Mexico, then Arizona and there is nothing left of our elk and deer herds. If we do nothing, I can guarantee you that in a matter of 10 years elk hunting in the U.S. will be nothing but a memory. Shoot those damn wolves!

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from graphicgary wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

As far as public land goes, to me this comes down to whether you want to hunt in the wild or on a managed preserve. One of my joys when hunting is unexpectedly discovering the presence and activities of wild animals, including the ones I'm NOT hunting. But then, I hike a lot when I hunt instead of riding everywhere. Wolves, what are they and what they do should be a part of the outdoors experience, as is true with bears and panthers. If you want to hunt in a place where the outcome is guaranteed and there are no real (or unpleasant) surprises, then hunt one of the many "safari ranches" and you'll be happy.

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from X2DKkiller wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

sheriff go ahead and put your dog on a leash and take it for a walk out here, if you think just because your there with it a pack of wolves wont try anything you are mistaken. And to set things straight Idaho had a healthy population of Timber wolve already well we used to untill they shoved the grey wolf down our throats.

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from sheriff8287 wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Montanagyrene- Put up a dog run for your daughters dog when it can not be supervised.
Maybe the reason the people back east or government makes decisions on wolf management for you folks out west is because the last time it was left in your hands the wolf went extinct in the area.

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from X2DKkiller wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Idaho spent alot of time and money building up our elk and deer herds and improving habitat. Now what took 20 years to accomplish only took 2 years to lose and we have to start over and spend more money which means higher licence and tag fees which means less people in the field. How much money do you think DOW and Peta are willing to chip in to help the game herds? I bet none.

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from tom343 wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Introduce them in NYC's Central, Prospect and Van Courtland Park, Philly's Fairmont Park, NJ's Great Swamp and Tock's Island and Pennsylvania's 'Wilds' and see what happens.

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from dhottell wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Invasive species are organisms that are introduced into a non-native ecosystem and which cause, or are likely to cause, harm to the economy, environment or human health. It is important to note that when we talk about a species being invasive, we are talking about environmental boundaries, not political ones. In addition to the many invasive species from outside the U.S., there are many species from within the U.S. that are invasive in other parts of the country.

This is from the USF&W website. Seems very clear to me that reintroduced wolves fit that bill. This discussion has made me realize that my high hopes for hunting this fall might be very optimistic. There has to be a way to solve this problem without going to jail or bankrupt.

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from Montanagyrene wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Personally, I find Mr. Schlickeisen's comment(#3) especially ill-informed and EXTREMELY biased, not to mention just plain IGNORANT!!! When he said “The court’s ruling makes it clear that decisions under the Endangered Species Act should be based on science, not politics.”, what he and the other groups were, and ARE doing is using POLITICS to TRUMP SOUND SCIENTIFIC MANAGEMENT!!!! As to the ranchers getting 'compensated' for their losses, the 'compensation' doesn't even cover the WORTH of the ANIMAL that was killed, never mind possible future production!! My parents raised me to respect the law, even if I may not agree with it, so unless my family or I am threatened, I won't shoot...By the way, I REFUSE to let a wolf or pack kill my daughter's dog if I can help it...One more thought-why is it that the people back East seem to know what we want/need BETTER than those of us that live out here in the West?

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from charlie elk wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Many times in life we find the law and the moral law conflict. To me the moral law is supreme and civil disobedience is required.
The idea we should be expected to follow all laws blindly is repugnant.
An extreme example:
Owning slaves was once legal; the law of the land. Were those who violated the law to free the slaves criminals? Civil disobedience has a fine tradition in our country.
Stay safe my friends.
later,
charlie

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from MWK_MN wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Just wait till the big game herds have diminished even more and the wolf packs have increased even more, you'll see more cases like that lady in Alaska who was killed and eaten. Especially with their no fear of humans as a result of us not showing them who's on top of the food chain.

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from gmbhunter wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Winefly---obviously you are a gun hunter only. The shot was good. Deer shot with an arrow don't topple over on on the spot like when "blown to hell" with a high powered rifle. Waited 2 hours to start looking(fully dark)---looked for 2 more---you can only wander around in the swamp so long at night-------deer was only 80 yards from stand.
Game management and hunter revenue is what has created the large deer herds that are present in most states----LET THE PROFESSIONAL GAME MANAGERS MANAGE THE RESOURCES(including wolves) AND KEEP THE POLITICIANS OUT OF IT. Get online with state of WI and look up wolves---they have a good website listing where the wolf packs currently are and how many animals---overlay that with the anterless tag map---------do not need to be a mathmetician to see--------no wolves----lot of deer tags---------------wolf packs present---few deer tags.

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from docwells2000 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

As a hunter in central Texas I can only relate to this problem with the rise of coyote and bobcat populations in our area. Due to those predators our wood duck and mallard populations are down dramatically. I have witnessed bobcats chasing fawns. Predators can be a real issue and it's up to us, the hunters to unite and change the legislation. We're being attacked on all fronts, from gun control to protecting the wolves. Honestly, I'm not sure why wolves have been reintroduced without a management plan in place across all of the states that provides the ability to schedule hunts, under control of the States's Game and Fish Departments. There has been an upswell of liberalism in this country since 2008. It's time to get active as conservatives (and conservationists) and reform our governmnent through elections. While the NRA fights for gun rights we need a central organization to fight for hunter's rights. It's the only way to stop the liberal nipping and slow bleed of our rights as hunters. Write letters to your F&G departments, elect those officials that support hunter's rights and understand conservation. We can help our outdoors industries and our hunting heritage grow so that every generation of Americans understands the basic freedom of the hunt and the true roots of our nation and mankind.

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from Winefly wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Deer & elk are dropping because they are being hunted & poached beyond what the system can support.
gmbhunter you said 5000 doe tags & 2500 tags only 2 years ago DO YA THINK THAT MIGHT HAVE HAD AN IMPACT ON DEER POPULATIONS???? a hell of a lot more dead deer than the wolves could have accounted for. I shoot deer but like the wolves I take all of it not just the head & leave the rest to rot. You also Arrowed a buck which the wolves got was it a poor shot? the wolves were doing exactly what they have always done clean up your mistake, the old the weak & injured.
HELLO you can't have your cake & eat it, wrightchrisj you are a damn fool next you'll say the Bison has been wiped out by wolves not our wasteful forefathers

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from CTGOLFER wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

From the comments here I can see that most folks here have no idea how much damage the wolves have already done in many areas. Elk quotas are being cut back, seasons are being closed and moose tags are dropping big time. In many areas of Idaho there are no moose where 12-20 used to winter, places where 75 to 100 cow elk would drop 2o-35 calves there a 2-3, many places the only elk are older and will be gone in a couple of years. Outfitters are going bankrupt as well as ranchers. We tried to play nice, poaching is a terrible menace but there is a time when a man has to do what is right in life and not what is legal, kill the damn wolves on the spot. I was there protesting the release of these Canadian Grey wolves with a handful of ranchers back in the 90’s, this whole mess is a bunch of eco-freaks dreams that will hurt hunting forever unless we fight. Join a grass roots group like Save Western wildlife and stand together to beat this thing or we will regret it for the rest of our lives.

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from jerramor wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Hey Chelataway---good comment! About your mentioning "eat what you shoot"---last year we hunted Idaho---six of us--and my friend's wife is Latina. Wolf aint half bad! We had wolf tamales, wolf enchiladas, wolf stew, wolf burritos, wolf and scrambled eggs---all quite tasty, we ate everything but the howl! Tastes like chicken........

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from Chaletaway wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Another thought ladies and gentle men, seals in the Columbia River are killing thousands of sturgeon, and 100's of thousands of salmon every year. The swim along a fish take a bite and swim on. The rest is gone. They won't open a season on those animals at all.They are too cute. Left side of the world .

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from Chaletaway wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Bears, wolves, coyotes, house cats , bob cats, cougar,your let loose house dog. You name it and they are all a predator.
Agreed, the bigger ones take bigger game and we only see a small portion of that. The point is if every one gets in a big huff over these pictures of propaganda and thats what they are. I think we are missing that valid point too.
I am not impressed with an "OH MY GOD,LOOK AT THAT" picture. I am more impressed in what each state game and fish organization is doing on the good side of conservation. We all have to recognize the fact that our outdoors is shrinking,states are selling more and more public land to the private sector.
Well off the subject a bit but remember eat what you shoot and do the best you can to preserve what we have left..
Happy trails
Chuck

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from jerramor wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

All in favor of wolf vigilantism----cast your vote here. just click "yes" on the comment section and let's see the numbers by the end of September. Fight fire WITH fire!!!!!!!!

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from cjohnsrud wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Well said Buglejack.

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from jerramor wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Wolves have been removed for over 100 years by people who think alot differently than those of today. 100+ years of ecosystem big game management has improved the deer and elk herds to be more plentiful in numbers than in the days of the Indian and modern day game management is a system that simply works. 100% of taxes from hunting, fishing and camping revenue is fed into wildlife management.It's a system that works,period. Throw a breeding pack of carnivorous predators into the foray and you wreak havoc on a system that litterally brings hundreds of millions of dollars to states from hunting and fishing.The only winners are the wolves. The political cronies knew this when they voted on the subject. If they can't take our guns they can destroy our reason to use them, primarily hunting. To me, being a wolf vigilante is far less a crime than that imposed upon us by the politicians.

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from buglejack wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Remember that the groups that filed suit are not interested in any game management plan that includes hunting & people defending the "no hunt" theory will ignore the fact that wildlife populations have generally expanded when they're treated as a game species. Economics also come into play. Rather than unmanaged wildlife populations costing taxpayers money, huntable resources generate revenue & create jobs. Sadly, anti-hunters are more interested in their personal agenda & feelings, than they are about the welfare of the species. It's kind of funny, I just came back from a trip to Montana and most people I talked with really weren't opposed to living with wolves, but they were resentful about outside interests coming into the state and telling them how to live with wolves. Shooting every wolf you see isn't the answer, but impacted states developing a sound management plan and responsible sportsmen and women publicly voicing their positions is.

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from Jeepdude1987 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Here in New Mexico people took the Mexican Wolves and used the three S's. That would be shoot, shovel, and shut up. And, now they are on the verge of giving up, but we also didn't let a minnow kill our river flow like the Californian's.

I think that if the Wildlife management agencies of Idaho, Montana, and Wyoming told the Feds to enforce their laws and they might see the Feds change their tune a bit.

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from www.dropjhook.com wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I say "I want my WOLF steak"

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from critterkiller79 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

sheriff8287 - Quite obvious you are not a deer hunter. If you are, you're the only person in Northern WI that is grateful for what the wolf has done. Killing livestock, family pets, bear hounds and turned the once bountiful whitetail deer into nearly an endangered species. Yes, thank goodness for the wolf... Wolves should be managed (hunted) the same as any other species when their population gets out of control.

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from Redboyrudy wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Hey gmbhunter, I'm from New Hampshire and I'm not defending the wolf. We have them here. Fish and Game doesn't admit that but I see them up north all the time. They come down from Canada on our northern border.

Personally I don't think it's poaching if you shoot a predator. You gotta do what you gotta do. I consider it self defense.

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from tovlogos wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

No doubt they want to eliminate all guns and all hunting; and create a sort of nirvana -- where nature works in an orderly fashion, and all is well and lovely. Not happening on this planet.

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from t_bell40 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Wow !! That would suck to be pulling on "sruffy's" chain only to find what is left of "scruffy" on the end of it. Not funny i know, but, i am chuckling a little. I wonder how they would do with cats..........hhmmmm ??

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from tovlogos wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I can't believe the government is so ignorant of the obvious points most of you are making. Organizations like PETA would see you dead rather than animals. Perhaps some of this mentality spills over into the liberal mentality. It just doesn't make sense.

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from dhottell wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I still dont understand why and animal that is 16500 strong(includes alaska and canada, wolves do worry about borders) is even on the endangered species list. Bottom line, wolves cost us (taxpayers, hunters, ranchers) lots and lots of money. Politicians and animal rights groups benefit monetarily from our lack of cohesiveness on this. Wolves were almost exterminated for a good reason. I say go back to the old ways, SSS, and beware of collars, pick up your brass.

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from 5milebar wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Wolves are killing dogs at a high rate in Wi. Not only hunting dogs, but house dogs. A beagle mix was let out of the house at 2 a.m. a cpl days ago, for potty break, and the owner couln't find it a few minutes later, to bring back in. Daylight came, and there were wolf tracks mixed with the dogs tracks 40 feet,(YES, 13 YARDS) from the house. The dog was never found!! Wolves have killed 17 CONFIRMED dogs so far this year in Wi.
Blast & bury.

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from t_bell40 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I THINK !!! THAT EACH AREA SHOULD BE DECIDING WHAT IS NECESSARY FOR THEIR AREA !! IF WOLF POPULATIONS ARE DECIMATING AN AREA THEN SOMETHING HAS TO BE DONE I.E. HUNTING.

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from metricka wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

What does the government do well other than spend our money?
Shoot Them!!

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from gbodily wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I won't shoot them because it is against the rules, even though the rules are not correct. However, I would loan my gun to someone that doesn't mind breaking the rules.
gb

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from doylebigd wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

It appears to me that you folks don't reconise the real issue here. The people that vote in these people that make up these laws. If you don't like what these people are doing make sure to not vote for them.

I live in MN but I choose not to support the DNR in MN because I don't support the way they manage game in MN. I hunt several states and Canada that I support the methods for managing game.

As for the ranchers, they get paid for lost animals but it doesn't pay for lost production from that animal. Again for the ranchers, vote for the people that are going to back you on your thoughts.

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from GoldToyBox wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

In reguards to "S.S.S." it's been effective in the past but still not a very good management tool and diffinately against the law (high risk). I know it's used in Minn & else where.

As for Rancher being compensated for losses due to wolf damage, is it being paid by?
Federal Govt? what branch? what is the funding?
State Govt? what branch? what is the funding?
I suspect the costs will be borne by Sportsman just like these court contests.

Millions of our sportman dollars in licence/fees/exsize taxes to manage our deer & elk populations since the 1950's only to see it go out the window over the mis-management of the wolf.

And the donkey that thinks; "wolfs ability to manage game populations in a natural way". Works fine on paper but not in the field. Man as invaded the area with farming & ranching operations, mining and recreation. When the deer & elk numbers drop in an area the wolf will be forced to hunt/kill livestock, pets or worse. Not that difficult to see where the wolf is now; the deer & elk numbers are DOWN, outfitters are going out of business, hunters are not spending their dollars in those area's (gas, food, lodging, etc).

Bottom line, the wolf should be managed as a game animal with seasons, limits, quotas, & science.

Off my soap box.

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from Bull Elk wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

See a wolf.....shoot a wolf. If our own government cannot protect wildlife, then hunters will do it for them. What happens when there is nothing left for wolves to eat after all the game animals have been decimated? You'll have lots and lots of wolves and nothing "wild" for them to survive on....but survive they will. Just make sure you stay out of the woods!

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from sheriff8287 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

gmbhunter - I have a place in Minocqua Wi and I am greatful for what the wolf has done... Less deer car collisions and less starving deer.

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from gmbhunter wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Sheriff8287----Who do you thinks pays for the restitution to the rancers-------WE ALL DO. Somehow i suspect you live in a state without any wolves---let us know and maybe we can get WI to ship some to your local hunting area----give it about 3 years and you will not see much to hunt.

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from RemsDad wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

In Michigan our DNR doesn't say too much about the wolf. They used to update us on the moose population which they traded with Ontario for, but now they don't talk about them much either. I wonder what their story will be now that there is confirmation of breeding wolves in Cheboygan County, not mention the confirmation of cougars...and in the Northern Lower Peninsula!

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from gmbhunter wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Alex----I have hunted the same area in N.Wisconsin for 20+ years----YES,YES,YES,--the wolves have become a factor---inspite of what the DNR tries to deny. Zone I hunt gave out 5,000 doe tags 2 years ago, 2500 tags last year,,, less than 500 this year(very mild winter---so winterkill is not a valid excuse). If we saw a wolf once evry 2-3 years we thought that was lucky----we have seen wolves every year for the past 4 years. Arrowed a buck 2 years ago at dusk---found carcass the next morning---wolves ate 75%---finished it off next night.
Locals, all say shoot them----IT IS STILL POACHING--state tried to get delisted but Federal court ruled the "region" had not reached goals----region included more states than WI,MN,MI,----virtually same problem they are having out west.
Maybe if we let 12 breeding pairs loose in NY,VT,PA,NH,---we can bring this to an end----let the eastern states have the same problem that they continue to defend.

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from MTHank wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Not sure why but it seems that Molloy rules on the side of the environmentalists most of the time. Not sure if this is true but not much is heard otherwise...

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from wrightchrisj wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

It is sad but true that the Outdoor enthusiasts, hunters, campers, hikers, RV'ers, and anyone that likes to be outdoors has been duped by the 'Wildlife Conservancy' and all their cohorts in the lawsuit to keep wolves on the Endangered Species Act. For them to quote science is a real joke.
1. Wolves are not endangered.
2. There are way more Wolves out there than quoted in this article -- way more.
3. Wolves have absolutely decimated Elk, Deer, and Moose populations.
4. Wolves have ruined hunting seasons, the livelihood of outfitters, and planned and hoped for hunts of thousands of people.

Theses are the facts.

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from sheriff8287 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

What is wrong with some of you? Its ok to have a dog help you hunt but not one hunting for its self. Are you threatend by the wolfs ability to manage game populations in a natural way? Last I heard, ranchers that suffered losses due to wolf kills were being reinbursed. The wolf is just a part of restoring a natural system.

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from Alex Robinson wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Thanks for the comments guys. Northmichhunter, Good question. The powers that be consider the wolves in Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota separate from the wolves in the Rockies. Minnesota actually has more wolves (3,000) than any other state in the lower 48. But wolves in the Great Lakes region are still protected and there is no hunting season for them (as you know). I suspect there is less controversy over wolves in Minnesota because wolves were always there and people are pretty use to them. In the West, wolves were reintroduced.

What do all you Great Lakes region hunters have to say about it? Is there any sign that wolves are decimating deer herds up there?

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from Michael Sutherin wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Shoot'em.

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from northmichhunter wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I guess if i was a rancher and my investment was at danger shoot and cover up the tracks!!!!! Either way its just a wild dog! whats up with michigan and wisconsin there are alot of wolves in these areas as well.

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from djohns13 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Laws are laws even when science doesn't support them. Some of the individuals who choose to poach wolves will end up getting caught and this will be a setback to our goal of managed wolf populations through an agressive hunting program. The individuals who are emotionally supporting the listing of wolves as endangered are not our friends in any respect, but I don't think the poachers should be considered a sportsman's friend either.

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from cjohnsrud wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

S. S. S.

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from X2DKkiller wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Well as stated whether the wolf humppers like it or not wolves will be shot this year. What they dont realize is without a season and limits to some people its just fair game which is just going to hurt us all in the end. The damn thing were better off with a season, now the people that dont want us to hunt them just put a bounty on thier heads.

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from gmbhunter wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Alex----I have hunted the same area in N.Wisconsin for 20+ years----YES,YES,YES,--the wolves have become a factor---inspite of what the DNR tries to deny. Zone I hunt gave out 5,000 doe tags 2 years ago, 2500 tags last year,,, less than 500 this year(very mild winter---so winterkill is not a valid excuse). If we saw a wolf once evry 2-3 years we thought that was lucky----we have seen wolves every year for the past 4 years. Arrowed a buck 2 years ago at dusk---found carcass the next morning---wolves ate 75%---finished it off next night.
Locals, all say shoot them----IT IS STILL POACHING--state tried to get delisted but Federal court ruled the "region" had not reached goals----region included more states than WI,MN,MI,----virtually same problem they are having out west.
Maybe if we let 12 breeding pairs loose in NY,VT,PA,NH,---we can bring this to an end----let the eastern states have the same problem that they continue to defend.

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from CTGOLFER wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

From the comments here I can see that most folks here have no idea how much damage the wolves have already done in many areas. Elk quotas are being cut back, seasons are being closed and moose tags are dropping big time. In many areas of Idaho there are no moose where 12-20 used to winter, places where 75 to 100 cow elk would drop 2o-35 calves there a 2-3, many places the only elk are older and will be gone in a couple of years. Outfitters are going bankrupt as well as ranchers. We tried to play nice, poaching is a terrible menace but there is a time when a man has to do what is right in life and not what is legal, kill the damn wolves on the spot. I was there protesting the release of these Canadian Grey wolves with a handful of ranchers back in the 90’s, this whole mess is a bunch of eco-freaks dreams that will hurt hunting forever unless we fight. Join a grass roots group like Save Western wildlife and stand together to beat this thing or we will regret it for the rest of our lives.

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from phowriter@msn.com wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

As usual when the federal government gets involved good things are done away with. The history of the federal government and the so called environmentalists have mostly made things worse and with this so called judge making a ruling that will help increase the populaton of the wolf packs, I can't help but say that "the only good wolf is a dead wolf" and there will probably be more wolves killed illegally than there would have been killed legally. This is just another ruling that will make many law-abiding people take the law into their own hands. But I guess the judge and the environmentalists can't help help themselves, "ignorant is as ignorant does".

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from Montanagyrene wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Personally, I find Mr. Schlickeisen's comment(#3) especially ill-informed and EXTREMELY biased, not to mention just plain IGNORANT!!! When he said “The court’s ruling makes it clear that decisions under the Endangered Species Act should be based on science, not politics.”, what he and the other groups were, and ARE doing is using POLITICS to TRUMP SOUND SCIENTIFIC MANAGEMENT!!!! As to the ranchers getting 'compensated' for their losses, the 'compensation' doesn't even cover the WORTH of the ANIMAL that was killed, never mind possible future production!! My parents raised me to respect the law, even if I may not agree with it, so unless my family or I am threatened, I won't shoot...By the way, I REFUSE to let a wolf or pack kill my daughter's dog if I can help it...One more thought-why is it that the people back East seem to know what we want/need BETTER than those of us that live out here in the West?

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from joe gauthreaux wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

I really have sympathy for our Americans who carve a living out of the land. We are pushed aside by those who call themselves ecologist.
In louisiana we were told that the Alligator was on the endangered species list, and no more public hunting was allowed. Now the alligator is off the endangered list , and the only hunters that are allowed are the landowners. Well not many of the public can afford the land that alligators live on
We are left with the few priveledged people that are allowed to get tags, and those of us who watch the depletion of all the wildlife that are now meals for the gators. Thats right no more fur bearing animals left to trap. We are literally up to our butts in alligators and nothing can be done about it , other than illegaly kill one , or wathc others get rich off our natural resourse, that really belongs to the citizens.
Lots of luck . We know how you feel.

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from cjohnsrud wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

S. S. S.

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from wrightchrisj wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

It is sad but true that the Outdoor enthusiasts, hunters, campers, hikers, RV'ers, and anyone that likes to be outdoors has been duped by the 'Wildlife Conservancy' and all their cohorts in the lawsuit to keep wolves on the Endangered Species Act. For them to quote science is a real joke.
1. Wolves are not endangered.
2. There are way more Wolves out there than quoted in this article -- way more.
3. Wolves have absolutely decimated Elk, Deer, and Moose populations.
4. Wolves have ruined hunting seasons, the livelihood of outfitters, and planned and hoped for hunts of thousands of people.

Theses are the facts.

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from Redboyrudy wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Hey gmbhunter, I'm from New Hampshire and I'm not defending the wolf. We have them here. Fish and Game doesn't admit that but I see them up north all the time. They come down from Canada on our northern border.

Personally I don't think it's poaching if you shoot a predator. You gotta do what you gotta do. I consider it self defense.

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from Jeepdude1987 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Here in New Mexico people took the Mexican Wolves and used the three S's. That would be shoot, shovel, and shut up. And, now they are on the verge of giving up, but we also didn't let a minnow kill our river flow like the Californian's.

I think that if the Wildlife management agencies of Idaho, Montana, and Wyoming told the Feds to enforce their laws and they might see the Feds change their tune a bit.

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from buglejack wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Remember that the groups that filed suit are not interested in any game management plan that includes hunting & people defending the "no hunt" theory will ignore the fact that wildlife populations have generally expanded when they're treated as a game species. Economics also come into play. Rather than unmanaged wildlife populations costing taxpayers money, huntable resources generate revenue & create jobs. Sadly, anti-hunters are more interested in their personal agenda & feelings, than they are about the welfare of the species. It's kind of funny, I just came back from a trip to Montana and most people I talked with really weren't opposed to living with wolves, but they were resentful about outside interests coming into the state and telling them how to live with wolves. Shooting every wolf you see isn't the answer, but impacted states developing a sound management plan and responsible sportsmen and women publicly voicing their positions is.

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from jerramor wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

All in favor of wolf vigilantism----cast your vote here. just click "yes" on the comment section and let's see the numbers by the end of September. Fight fire WITH fire!!!!!!!!

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from dhottell wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Invasive species are organisms that are introduced into a non-native ecosystem and which cause, or are likely to cause, harm to the economy, environment or human health. It is important to note that when we talk about a species being invasive, we are talking about environmental boundaries, not political ones. In addition to the many invasive species from outside the U.S., there are many species from within the U.S. that are invasive in other parts of the country.

This is from the USF&W website. Seems very clear to me that reintroduced wolves fit that bill. This discussion has made me realize that my high hopes for hunting this fall might be very optimistic. There has to be a way to solve this problem without going to jail or bankrupt.

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from X2DKkiller wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

sheriff go ahead and put your dog on a leash and take it for a walk out here, if you think just because your there with it a pack of wolves wont try anything you are mistaken. And to set things straight Idaho had a healthy population of Timber wolve already well we used to untill they shoved the grey wolf down our throats.

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from HuntingEditor wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

This is a great discussion, but I am a little nervous about all this enthusiastic vigilantism. I have two perspectives, one very practical: if Idaho gets its way then enforcement for wolves (and wolf poaching) will revert to the feds. And no sportsman I know wants to be on the receiving end of federal wildlife charges. The second perspective is a little more complicated. It's that we sportsmen will tarnish our reputations if we start to take matters in our own hands. Remember, many of us said that all we want is to manage wolves like other wildlife - by hunting and trapping them in legal, regulated seasons. I still maintain that's the best approach. If we start to shoot them illegally, then we just confirm to anti-hunting zealots that hunters can't be trusted to do the right thing, with wolves or other game animals.

Andrew McKean
Hunting Editor

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from X2DKkiller wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Well as stated whether the wolf humppers like it or not wolves will be shot this year. What they dont realize is without a season and limits to some people its just fair game which is just going to hurt us all in the end. The damn thing were better off with a season, now the people that dont want us to hunt them just put a bounty on thier heads.

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from Alex Robinson wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Thanks for the comments guys. Northmichhunter, Good question. The powers that be consider the wolves in Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota separate from the wolves in the Rockies. Minnesota actually has more wolves (3,000) than any other state in the lower 48. But wolves in the Great Lakes region are still protected and there is no hunting season for them (as you know). I suspect there is less controversy over wolves in Minnesota because wolves were always there and people are pretty use to them. In the West, wolves were reintroduced.

What do all you Great Lakes region hunters have to say about it? Is there any sign that wolves are decimating deer herds up there?

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from Bull Elk wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

See a wolf.....shoot a wolf. If our own government cannot protect wildlife, then hunters will do it for them. What happens when there is nothing left for wolves to eat after all the game animals have been decimated? You'll have lots and lots of wolves and nothing "wild" for them to survive on....but survive they will. Just make sure you stay out of the woods!

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from critterkiller79 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

sheriff8287 - Quite obvious you are not a deer hunter. If you are, you're the only person in Northern WI that is grateful for what the wolf has done. Killing livestock, family pets, bear hounds and turned the once bountiful whitetail deer into nearly an endangered species. Yes, thank goodness for the wolf... Wolves should be managed (hunted) the same as any other species when their population gets out of control.

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from docwells2000 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

As a hunter in central Texas I can only relate to this problem with the rise of coyote and bobcat populations in our area. Due to those predators our wood duck and mallard populations are down dramatically. I have witnessed bobcats chasing fawns. Predators can be a real issue and it's up to us, the hunters to unite and change the legislation. We're being attacked on all fronts, from gun control to protecting the wolves. Honestly, I'm not sure why wolves have been reintroduced without a management plan in place across all of the states that provides the ability to schedule hunts, under control of the States's Game and Fish Departments. There has been an upswell of liberalism in this country since 2008. It's time to get active as conservatives (and conservationists) and reform our governmnent through elections. While the NRA fights for gun rights we need a central organization to fight for hunter's rights. It's the only way to stop the liberal nipping and slow bleed of our rights as hunters. Write letters to your F&G departments, elect those officials that support hunter's rights and understand conservation. We can help our outdoors industries and our hunting heritage grow so that every generation of Americans understands the basic freedom of the hunt and the true roots of our nation and mankind.

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from charlie elk wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Many times in life we find the law and the moral law conflict. To me the moral law is supreme and civil disobedience is required.
The idea we should be expected to follow all laws blindly is repugnant.
An extreme example:
Owning slaves was once legal; the law of the land. Were those who violated the law to free the slaves criminals? Civil disobedience has a fine tradition in our country.
Stay safe my friends.
later,
charlie

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from tom343 wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Introduce them in NYC's Central, Prospect and Van Courtland Park, Philly's Fairmont Park, NJ's Great Swamp and Tock's Island and Pennsylvania's 'Wilds' and see what happens.

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from X2DKkiller wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Idaho spent alot of time and money building up our elk and deer herds and improving habitat. Now what took 20 years to accomplish only took 2 years to lose and we have to start over and spend more money which means higher licence and tag fees which means less people in the field. How much money do you think DOW and Peta are willing to chip in to help the game herds? I bet none.

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from tpbesone wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

I live and do most of my hunting in Minnesota. My primary deer hunting area is in the northern part of the state and I can say wolves definitely have an impact on deer herds. Not so say we're out of deer, but given how much wolve sign and wolves I see in a given year we should be able to manage them. Unfortunately the MN DNR isn't doing anything to try and get a hunt here. SSS is definitely used especially by older hunters. I don't participate but unfortunately this is the best solution some people see right now. Wolves have a right to the woods as much as we do, but if we are managing every other species why is this the exception?

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from gmbhunter wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Daverj37---glad to see someone else agrees deer in WI have declined----used to see 5-15 deer a day sitting in woods-----over past 10 years daily sighting numbers keep dropping---now lucky to see 2-3 a day---as I said earlier---see wolves every year now.-------------Tom343---love the idea--lets ship breeding pairs to a whole bunch of states---that way all of them can have cute little wolf pictures----but no deer to hunt.

Editor--I agree with Bullelk----won't need a hunting magazine if no one can hunt----maybe shefiff8287 if he is a fisherman---but the rest of us may have to take up golf. NOT looking to be vigilantes---just would like the federal government to let the states manage their own natural resources---including hunting wolves if they deem it necessary.

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from charlie elk wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Good post dhottell you bring up a good point -
When the government basically violates their regulations and laws they lose their moral authority making themselves immoral. Leaving a citizen the choice between civil disobedience in an attempt change the government's policy or cowering in fear of their government.
later,
charlie

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from rocco89815 wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

This whole thing is a terrible joke. Idaho game populations are being jeopardized due to the ignorance and emotional whims of politicians and bunny-huggers. Why should Idaho and Montana hunters suffer due to the blind stubbornness of a Wyoming democrat? Let Wyoming suffer it's own decisions. Idaho and Montana have proven they can successfully manage their own herds, and they know what's best for their own populations. I've never been a poacher, nor advocated it, (and I hate to say this) but if I come across a wolf in my hunting area this fall, chances are I'll take a shot at it. I'm taking a stand for what I believe.

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from Montanagyrene wrote 3 years 40 weeks ago

I feel that I HAVE to reply to Gregory L.A. Chilcote’ s comment about ”just as they irrationally over-react to the brucellosis threat posed by free roaming bison”. Brucellosis is ACTUALLY a VERY serious deal!! I’d hate to think of all the taxes I’ve paid over the years that were directed towards making states able to be certified ‘brucellosis free’, only to LOSE that certification because of some misguided comments!! Do I advocate extermination of the bison herds? Not in the slightest!! What I DO believe in, and this goes for ANY animal, is sound, SCIENTIFIC controls, and that the POLITICIANS and so-called ENVIRONMENTALISTS keep OUT OF THE WAY!! Sorry for the tirade, but the ONLY people I’ve ever seen putting their money where their mouth is seem to be those purchase hunting and fishing licenses, boat fuel, equipment, etc.

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from djohns13 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Laws are laws even when science doesn't support them. Some of the individuals who choose to poach wolves will end up getting caught and this will be a setback to our goal of managed wolf populations through an agressive hunting program. The individuals who are emotionally supporting the listing of wolves as endangered are not our friends in any respect, but I don't think the poachers should be considered a sportsman's friend either.

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from northmichhunter wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I guess if i was a rancher and my investment was at danger shoot and cover up the tracks!!!!! Either way its just a wild dog! whats up with michigan and wisconsin there are alot of wolves in these areas as well.

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from RemsDad wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

In Michigan our DNR doesn't say too much about the wolf. They used to update us on the moose population which they traded with Ontario for, but now they don't talk about them much either. I wonder what their story will be now that there is confirmation of breeding wolves in Cheboygan County, not mention the confirmation of cougars...and in the Northern Lower Peninsula!

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from doylebigd wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

It appears to me that you folks don't reconise the real issue here. The people that vote in these people that make up these laws. If you don't like what these people are doing make sure to not vote for them.

I live in MN but I choose not to support the DNR in MN because I don't support the way they manage game in MN. I hunt several states and Canada that I support the methods for managing game.

As for the ranchers, they get paid for lost animals but it doesn't pay for lost production from that animal. Again for the ranchers, vote for the people that are going to back you on your thoughts.

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from 5milebar wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Wolves are killing dogs at a high rate in Wi. Not only hunting dogs, but house dogs. A beagle mix was let out of the house at 2 a.m. a cpl days ago, for potty break, and the owner couln't find it a few minutes later, to bring back in. Daylight came, and there were wolf tracks mixed with the dogs tracks 40 feet,(YES, 13 YARDS) from the house. The dog was never found!! Wolves have killed 17 CONFIRMED dogs so far this year in Wi.
Blast & bury.

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from t_bell40 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Wow !! That would suck to be pulling on "sruffy's" chain only to find what is left of "scruffy" on the end of it. Not funny i know, but, i am chuckling a little. I wonder how they would do with cats..........hhmmmm ??

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from tovlogos wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

No doubt they want to eliminate all guns and all hunting; and create a sort of nirvana -- where nature works in an orderly fashion, and all is well and lovely. Not happening on this planet.

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from Chaletaway wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Bears, wolves, coyotes, house cats , bob cats, cougar,your let loose house dog. You name it and they are all a predator.
Agreed, the bigger ones take bigger game and we only see a small portion of that. The point is if every one gets in a big huff over these pictures of propaganda and thats what they are. I think we are missing that valid point too.
I am not impressed with an "OH MY GOD,LOOK AT THAT" picture. I am more impressed in what each state game and fish organization is doing on the good side of conservation. We all have to recognize the fact that our outdoors is shrinking,states are selling more and more public land to the private sector.
Well off the subject a bit but remember eat what you shoot and do the best you can to preserve what we have left..
Happy trails
Chuck

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from gmbhunter wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Winefly---obviously you are a gun hunter only. The shot was good. Deer shot with an arrow don't topple over on on the spot like when "blown to hell" with a high powered rifle. Waited 2 hours to start looking(fully dark)---looked for 2 more---you can only wander around in the swamp so long at night-------deer was only 80 yards from stand.
Game management and hunter revenue is what has created the large deer herds that are present in most states----LET THE PROFESSIONAL GAME MANAGERS MANAGE THE RESOURCES(including wolves) AND KEEP THE POLITICIANS OUT OF IT. Get online with state of WI and look up wolves---they have a good website listing where the wolf packs currently are and how many animals---overlay that with the anterless tag map---------do not need to be a mathmetician to see--------no wolves----lot of deer tags---------------wolf packs present---few deer tags.

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from Bull Elk wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

I have never commented on the same topic twice, but this issue has got my blood boiling. What the wolf has done in the last 10 years may take twice that long to repair, but ONLY if we do something about it right now. I say to every hunter that enters the woods this Fall. If you see a wolf, shoot it. If you see two wolves, shoot both. I hunt in Colorado where the elk herds are doing well. How long before wolves enter this state, then New Mexico, then Arizona and there is nothing left of our elk and deer herds. If we do nothing, I can guarantee you that in a matter of 10 years elk hunting in the U.S. will be nothing but a memory. Shoot those damn wolves!

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from Bull Elk wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Andrew, I understand what you are saying, but as we continue this discussion more of our big game animals are being killed by wolves. Yes, my comments may be taken as a little over the top, but it seems clear that the wolf situation is out of control and our government cannot or does not know how to fix it. My fear is that by the time we are able to address the wolf problem, elk, big horn sheep, moose and other big game animals will be seen only by those visiting a museum. When big game no longer exists and hunters have no reason to hunt anymore, will Outdoor Life, and you as O.L. Hunting Editor be relevent?

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from wv trapper wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

These tree huggers and animal huggers are ruining everything.They need to go back under the rock they came from and mind their own business.I wonder what they would say if it was their livestock or thier pet that was killed by wolves, would they want to save them then.They should have never restocked those wolves, they have done more damage than good.

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from MTHank wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Not sure why but it seems that Molloy rules on the side of the environmentalists most of the time. Not sure if this is true but not much is heard otherwise...

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from gbodily wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I won't shoot them because it is against the rules, even though the rules are not correct. However, I would loan my gun to someone that doesn't mind breaking the rules.
gb

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from t_bell40 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I THINK !!! THAT EACH AREA SHOULD BE DECIDING WHAT IS NECESSARY FOR THEIR AREA !! IF WOLF POPULATIONS ARE DECIMATING AN AREA THEN SOMETHING HAS TO BE DONE I.E. HUNTING.

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from dhottell wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I still dont understand why and animal that is 16500 strong(includes alaska and canada, wolves do worry about borders) is even on the endangered species list. Bottom line, wolves cost us (taxpayers, hunters, ranchers) lots and lots of money. Politicians and animal rights groups benefit monetarily from our lack of cohesiveness on this. Wolves were almost exterminated for a good reason. I say go back to the old ways, SSS, and beware of collars, pick up your brass.

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from tovlogos wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I can't believe the government is so ignorant of the obvious points most of you are making. Organizations like PETA would see you dead rather than animals. Perhaps some of this mentality spills over into the liberal mentality. It just doesn't make sense.

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from jerramor wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Wolves have been removed for over 100 years by people who think alot differently than those of today. 100+ years of ecosystem big game management has improved the deer and elk herds to be more plentiful in numbers than in the days of the Indian and modern day game management is a system that simply works. 100% of taxes from hunting, fishing and camping revenue is fed into wildlife management.It's a system that works,period. Throw a breeding pack of carnivorous predators into the foray and you wreak havoc on a system that litterally brings hundreds of millions of dollars to states from hunting and fishing.The only winners are the wolves. The political cronies knew this when they voted on the subject. If they can't take our guns they can destroy our reason to use them, primarily hunting. To me, being a wolf vigilante is far less a crime than that imposed upon us by the politicians.

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from jerramor wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Hey Chelataway---good comment! About your mentioning "eat what you shoot"---last year we hunted Idaho---six of us--and my friend's wife is Latina. Wolf aint half bad! We had wolf tamales, wolf enchiladas, wolf stew, wolf burritos, wolf and scrambled eggs---all quite tasty, we ate everything but the howl! Tastes like chicken........

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from www.dropjhook.com wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

If you really care about not letting animals go extinct you would realise that since wolves came back the number of the already slim number of bighorn sheep has been dropping like crazy & within a short period the bighorn sheep will be on the endangered list! But hey it's probly what you anti's want, less & less reasons for Americans to go hunting!!

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from X2DKkiller wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Andrew I agree with you that is what I am worried about is people just shooting them and then we will never have our chance. We will just be back to sqaure one. But they do need to be managed.

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from Montanagyrene wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

To sheriff8287: It is OBVIOUS that you are misinformed, sir…The wolf never ‘went extinct in the area’ at all!! In spite of the PROVEN presence of wolves, both in Montana, where I used to live, and in Idaho, where I now reside, we STILL got ‘reintroduction’ SHOVED down our throats…As for the ‘dog run’ suggestion, our dog is in a SECURELY maintained back yard in a suburban area, so I guess that qualifies…However, since we enjoy camping, and our dog might be along with us, protection extends to him as well…

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from nateshamp wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Why doesn't Wyoming just change the management plan? Wolves would get delisted, and a season could be in place.

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from fisherus wrote 3 years 9 weeks ago

Coastal-Coyote,
Don't know our biology,huh? When did you learn yours. I didn't take a retarded chimpanzee very long to figure out that wolves kill and kill and kill. If you're so smart, then why did our forefathers out west finally have to eliminate wolves to sustain their cattle business's. Why didn't the wiley old wolf just stick to eating wildgame? Well, Mr. Smarts, the wolf had depleted the wildlife to almost extinction before Teddy Roosevelt saw what was happening and the Feds started eliminating them. If that hadn't happened, we wouldn't have any elk left. If we don't get control and limit their numbers it will happen now. Actually, it already has. You just really don't know much do you?

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from gmbhunter wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Sheriff8287----Who do you thinks pays for the restitution to the rancers-------WE ALL DO. Somehow i suspect you live in a state without any wolves---let us know and maybe we can get WI to ship some to your local hunting area----give it about 3 years and you will not see much to hunt.

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from GoldToyBox wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

In reguards to "S.S.S." it's been effective in the past but still not a very good management tool and diffinately against the law (high risk). I know it's used in Minn & else where.

As for Rancher being compensated for losses due to wolf damage, is it being paid by?
Federal Govt? what branch? what is the funding?
State Govt? what branch? what is the funding?
I suspect the costs will be borne by Sportsman just like these court contests.

Millions of our sportman dollars in licence/fees/exsize taxes to manage our deer & elk populations since the 1950's only to see it go out the window over the mis-management of the wolf.

And the donkey that thinks; "wolfs ability to manage game populations in a natural way". Works fine on paper but not in the field. Man as invaded the area with farming & ranching operations, mining and recreation. When the deer & elk numbers drop in an area the wolf will be forced to hunt/kill livestock, pets or worse. Not that difficult to see where the wolf is now; the deer & elk numbers are DOWN, outfitters are going out of business, hunters are not spending their dollars in those area's (gas, food, lodging, etc).

Bottom line, the wolf should be managed as a game animal with seasons, limits, quotas, & science.

Off my soap box.

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from MWK_MN wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Just wait till the big game herds have diminished even more and the wolf packs have increased even more, you'll see more cases like that lady in Alaska who was killed and eaten. Especially with their no fear of humans as a result of us not showing them who's on top of the food chain.

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from daverj37 wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

I hunt in IL and WI and over the past 10 years have seen a severe decline in the WI deer population. In IL they are trying to take away our guns, and in WI they are taking away the reason to have guns.
All I can say is make sure you are informed and vote on election day.
And as for sheriff8287 maybe there was a reason they were hunted to extintion?

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from Gregory L.A. Ch... wrote 3 years 43 weeks ago

Wolf management is a particularly difficult issue because any discussion of it engenders powerful emotional responses on the parts of most of the participants. What outdoorsman doesn't thrill to the hauntingly eery howl of pure wilderness that is the song of the wolf? The reality is that wolves are very efficient predators who are going to remain an ever increasing presence in the West. Their efficiency is so complete, however, that they have been known to completely eliminate large prey from vast territories; leaving large regions devoid of ungulates for many decades. As proof, both the Alaska Peninsula and the Alaska's Seward peninsula had no moose populations prior to the late 1930's and the advent of wolf control measures instituted by the territory of Alaska. Now, both wolves and moose inhabit the area in significant numbers.
Regarding midwest wolves, I suspect they will become a problem in Minnesota and Michigan when they start preying on farm crops, new automobiles and mining products. In the west, however, they are viewed, and rightly so, as potential predators upon the area's chief industrial products; cattle and sheep. Personally I know some ranchers exaggerate this threat (just as they irrationally over-react to the brucellosis threat posed by free roaming bison), nevertheless the impact on wildlife resources cannot be overstated.
Wolves are a wildlife resource like any other; no more, or less deserving of intelligent management. Let's cut the hyperbole and work together to implement thoughtful controls and ensure the continued health of all our wildlife.
I want the thrill from hearing the howl of wolf in the midst of its' wilderness home...but not if it is the only large mammal left.

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from Michael Sutherin wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Shoot'em.

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from metricka wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

What does the government do well other than spend our money?
Shoot Them!!

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from www.dropjhook.com wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

I say "I want my WOLF steak"

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from cjohnsrud wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Well said Buglejack.

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from Chaletaway wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Another thought ladies and gentle men, seals in the Columbia River are killing thousands of sturgeon, and 100's of thousands of salmon every year. The swim along a fish take a bite and swim on. The rest is gone. They won't open a season on those animals at all.They are too cute. Left side of the world .

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from gloomhound wrote 3 years 41 weeks ago

That's not a wolf..it's a coyote. What kind of season do they have on coyotes out there?

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from elcazador wrote 3 years 41 weeks ago

How much sense does it make for a hunter not to be a tree hugger??? why would a hunter be against any paticular animal?? the wolf is decimating local deer and elk populations good lord are they better at decimating populations of species then humans??? i love the hunt i love nature but maybe some hunters should remember to respect and coexisit with nature instead of aiming there guns and shooting away. problems are not solved that way and hunting is not just about that. hunt the wolf but dont hate the wolf. maybe if hunters showed more respect and love for the great outdoors instead of just focusing on shooting everything in the great outdoors all of our fortunes would improve.

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from sheriff8287 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

gmbhunter - I have a place in Minocqua Wi and I am greatful for what the wolf has done... Less deer car collisions and less starving deer.

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from graphicgary wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

As far as public land goes, to me this comes down to whether you want to hunt in the wild or on a managed preserve. One of my joys when hunting is unexpectedly discovering the presence and activities of wild animals, including the ones I'm NOT hunting. But then, I hike a lot when I hunt instead of riding everywhere. Wolves, what are they and what they do should be a part of the outdoors experience, as is true with bears and panthers. If you want to hunt in a place where the outcome is guaranteed and there are no real (or unpleasant) surprises, then hunt one of the many "safari ranches" and you'll be happy.

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from kevcoachk wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

I live in NC & our wolf problem hasn't started, yet. I don't like anything about poaching or breaking game laws in in way; soooo it sounds like Wyoming (and others) should get with the program & met the legal requirements needed for lifting the protected status. Breaking the law only makes you a criminal, so as hunters let's do this the right way. We don't need to fuel the anti's campaign any more than we already do!!

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from Coastal-Coyote wrote 3 years 35 weeks ago

"B'AWW, WOLFS ARE EATING /MY/ ELK!"
Get. Over. It.
I fully support the reintroduction of Red Wolves to Florida, and, if they ever are, I won't be getting my panties in a bunch over it. Who CARES if a predator has to kill something to survive? The only reason why I hunt whitetails is because I need the meat. Beef is ridiculously expensive for such low-quality meat.
Yes, we DO need a season on Wolves. However, listing them as predators is a big no-no. The population is still recovering; there are areas that need wolf hunts, and areas that do NOT.
There WILL be drops in populations of game like Elk, and it WILL be drastic. This is completely natural and WILL straighten its self out- even if it takes several wobbly years. It just sounds like too many Elk Hunters, etc. are being offended by the fact that there won't be as many Elk for 'them' in the following seasons. YOU can stroll to Wal-Mart and buy a pack of frozen Ground Beef, but a Wolf, Coyote, Cougar, etc. can't.
Furthermore, ranchers are often PAID to not kill wolves in reaction to predation of their livestock.
On the topic of Wolves attacking domestic animals, so be it. Don't leave pet food out. ALWAYS leave lights on outside your house if you need to let the dog out at night, or, better yet, put their leash on. It's not hard.
HUNTERS SHOULD BE SUPPORTERS OF CONSERVATION.
I see this anti-predator bullshit EVERYWHERE. Did you guys not take High School Biology? Dear LORD. Have some respect for your environment.

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from Winefly wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

Deer & elk are dropping because they are being hunted & poached beyond what the system can support.
gmbhunter you said 5000 doe tags & 2500 tags only 2 years ago DO YA THINK THAT MIGHT HAVE HAD AN IMPACT ON DEER POPULATIONS???? a hell of a lot more dead deer than the wolves could have accounted for. I shoot deer but like the wolves I take all of it not just the head & leave the rest to rot. You also Arrowed a buck which the wolves got was it a poor shot? the wolves were doing exactly what they have always done clean up your mistake, the old the weak & injured.
HELLO you can't have your cake & eat it, wrightchrisj you are a damn fool next you'll say the Bison has been wiped out by wolves not our wasteful forefathers

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from Coastal-Coyote wrote 3 years 35 weeks ago

"B'AWW, WOLFS ARE EATING /MY/ ELK!"
Get. Over. It.
I fully support the reintroduction of Red Wolves to Florida, and, if they ever are, I won't be getting my panties in a bunch over it. Who CARES if a predator has to kill something to survive? The only reason why I hunt whitetails is because I need the meat. Beef is ridiculously expensive for such low-quality meat.
Yes, we DO need a season on Wolves. However, listing them as predators is a big no-no. The population is still recovering; there are areas that need wolf hunts, and areas that do NOT.
There WILL be drops in populations of game like Elk, and it WILL be drastic. This is completely natural and WILL straighten its self out- even if it takes several wobbly years. It just sounds like too many Elk Hunters, etc. are being offended by the fact that there won't be as many Elk for 'them' in the following seasons. YOU can stroll to Wal-Mart and buy a pack of frozen Ground Beef, but a Wolf, Coyote, Cougar, etc. can't.
Furthermore, ranchers are often PAID to not kill wolves in reaction to predation of their livestock.
On the topic of Wolves attacking domestic animals, so be it. Don't leave pet food out. ALWAYS leave lights on outside your house if you need to let the dog out at night, or, better yet, put their leash on. It's not hard.
HUNTERS SHOULD BE SUPPORTERS OF CONSERVATION.
I see this anti-predator bullshit EVERYWHERE. Did you guys not take High School Biology? Dear LORD. Have some respect for your environment.

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from sheriff8287 wrote 3 years 46 weeks ago

Montanagyrene- Put up a dog run for your daughters dog when it can not be supervised.
Maybe the reason the people back east or government makes decisions on wolf management for you folks out west is because the last time it was left in your hands the wolf went extinct in the area.

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from sheriff8287 wrote 3 years 47 weeks ago

What is wrong with some of you? Its ok to have a dog help you hunt but not one hunting for its self. Are you threatend by the wolfs ability to manage game populations in a natural way? Last I heard, ranchers that suffered losses due to wolf kills were being reinbursed. The wolf is just a part of restoring a natural system.

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